Is Your Pricing Legally Sound? Build Trust, Set Boundaries, Protect Your Business (Part 2)

In this episode of The Pricing Lady Podcast, I sit down for part two of my

conversation with Vena Verga Danemar on is Your Pricing Legally Sound.

We talk about discounts, currency, geo tagging, and more.

Sit back, relax, and enjoy the episode.

Before we dig in, this conversation is for information only.

It is not legal advice and does not create a lawyer client relationship.

Let's get started.

when it comes to discount and promotions mm-hmm I always joke with people that

they are very creative when it comes to lowering their prices and yes, not as

creative when it comes to raising them.

So there are rules there.

Sorry,

I have a little beef with discounts and promotions.

But yes, they can be effective.

When they're done, right?

Yes.

But what do Swiss or EU laws say when it comes to discounts or what now?

Prices and, and what you have to show or not show.

Yes.

This is a very important question, especially now we're

gonna have the Cyber Monday.

Yes.

Black Friday sales.

Absolutely.

So, yeah.

Discounts.

Mm-hmm.

When you're talking about discounts, you still need a price to compare

it with, because otherwise it cannot be a discount if you're not

comparing it with another price.

Right.

You need to have an older price.

Mm-hmm.

At least, or at least, um, a price to compare it with.

Mm-hmm.

Now let's talk about first in Switzerland.

In Switzerland again, we apply the pricing ordinance, the Swiss pricing ordinance,

and in this ordinance there is at least.

If I'm not mistaken, at least three scenarios that you have to think about.

First is if you are offering an introductory price, meaning this is the

first time that you actually offered something, you haven't offered it before,

so of course if you put introductory price, people will think this is a lower

price because it is an introductory price.

Okay.

But according to the PBV, you cannot use that label introductory price forever.

Really?

No, you cannot.

Why not?

You have only a maximum of two months to actually use that introductory price.

Because, again, in the head of your clients, that introductory price is the

lower price That is not your usual price.

Yes.

And you cannot have that label forever, right?

You only have two months to to do it again.

This is Swiss and you are dealing with consumers, okay?

Mm-hmm.

B2C.

Mm-hmm.

Now, what is the second scenario here?

You have an old price.

Mm-hmm.

But you haven't used it for 30 consecutive days.

So what is the rule?

The rule is you can use that old price, the previous old price as

comparison for only as for only half as long as the period during which the

real old price was applied or used.

It's very, a lot of words there.

I'm gonna explain through an ex example.

Mm-hmm.

Okay.

For example, you have a coaching course that's say a thousand francs.

Mm-hmm.

You offered it January one to 15 for 15 days, and then you stopped.

And then you offered it again, say November one to 10.

Okay.

So if you, some people would say, but I offered that 15 days and

then 10 days will, can I use.

Say a 1000 francs.

Mm-hmm.

That is the old price.

Mm-hmm.

Can I use it as a comparison?

Yes, you can.

But since you did not use that price for 30 consecutive days, you can only use it.

So in my example, mm-hmm.

The last time you use it is November one to 10, if I'm not mistaken.

Mm-hmm.

So 10 days, you can use that comparison price only for five days.

Half as long as you've used the old price, you used it, okay.

Yes.

Interesting.

So that is per, per prices that you've used for not for 30 consecutive days.

So what if you use a price for 30 consecutive days?

Mm-hmm.

You are rewarded by the law, meaning you can use the the comparison price

without any time limits restriction.

Okay.

No restrictions.

So if like forever, my, for example, my coaching course mm-hmm.

Is a thousand francs and I've used it like forever.

Mm-hmm.

More than 30 days.

I can always use that as my comparison price.

Mm-hmm.

So I can say it's now 500 instead of 1000.

Mm-hmm hmm.

And there's no restriction or time limit mm-hmm.

To that comparison.

Mm-hmm.

Okay.

So that is for Switzerland, right?

For the EU, it's.

Almost the same.

Mm-hmm.

But still different

of course.

So

in EU you still need to have a prior price uhhuh, like in Switzerland.

Right.

But your, your comparison price should be the lowest price that you have used

in the last 30 days before the reduction.

Okay.

So for example, today my coaching prize is 500 francs.

Mm-hmm.

And then in.

In, um, like in 30 days I want to join a Cyber Monday sale or whatever.

Mm-hmm.

I cannot say that.

The, that original price is a thousand.

If I increase the, the price to 1000 days before the, the sale, right.

The lowest price will be my comparison price.

Mm-hmm.

So what is the goal here?

The goal is to avoid fake discounts because we know it, there are businesses

who would say that this is their price.

So for example, their price has always been 500 cHFs or Euros.

And then a few days before the sale, they would increase it to a thousand.

Mm-hmm.

And then say 50% discount.

Right.

That is a fake discount.

Right.

And that is what we're trying to avoid through this loss again, transparency.

Yeah.

Yeah.

Yeah.

I think that's really important.

Yes.

This is for consumer, for B2C, for consumers

B2C.

Yes.

Because again, if it's B2B, you can always agree mm-hmm, as to the price.

But of course, it shouldn't be unfairly competing with others as well.

Although the consumer loss does not apply to your relationship,

you should always be fair.

Of course.

Of course, of course.

To, to them and to yourself.

Yes, exactly.

Okay, next one.

A little bit about currency mm-hmm, and geo blocking.

It's actually a conversation I recently had with someone and I was like, I think

that they're mixing some things here.

Yes.

And so there was a lot, especially here in Switzerland, a few years back around

this, and I think it was very specifically directed at B2C and digital businesses.

Exactly.

Can you tell us more about the currency and the geoblocking and

what really is the, the, you know, the meat on it behind, behind this?

What are we trying to achieve here?

Alright, so first currency can, the question that always pops up

is, can you actually have dual or more currency on your website?

Yes, you can.

Okay.

Whether in your, in the, you're in the EU or in Switzerland, you can have

multiple currencies on your website.

Mm-hmm.

The only thing is, if you are a Swiss business with Swiss customers, you

need to have Swiss francs there as one of the currency and as the base.

Okay.

And again, going back to what I've discussed a while ago, if you're gonna

put the price, it should be all inclusive.

If you're VAT registered, then VAT is already included in that pricing.

Mm-hmm.

Mm-hmm.

Now you can show a second currency, but you need to be very clear what is

the function of that second currency?

Is it just for informational purposes only?

Mm-hmm.

Meaning this is my price in CHF, and you can see that this

is the conversion rate in Euro.

So informational purposes only like an estimated.

Exactly.

Yeah.

Or is it actually an alternative offer?

So why am I try, what am I getting at here?

Mm-hmm.

Because if you put the price in such a way that it is an alternative

offer, meaning you show it like this, this is my digital course.

Mm-hmm.

It is 200 francs.

Or you can pay me 200 euros.

Mm-hmm.

So in the checkout they can see 200 CHF or 200 euros.

Mm-hmm.

At the same level.

And you are offering it as an alternative.

Mm-hmm.

Not just for informational purposes only.

Mm-hmm.

If the consumer actually picks Euro.

Even if they are in Switzerland, you cannot force them to pay you in CHF simply

because you gave two alternative offers.

Right.

So that's the thing that you need to remember when you have two currencies.

Mm-hmm.

Is it an alternative offer or mm-hmm.

Is it for informational purposes only?

Yeah.

So the second thing is, say you are a Swiss business or an EU business, and

you have clients in other countries.

Mm-hmm.

As I've said, you can have multiple currencies, but in terms of application,

there will be an issue there.

Okay?

Mm-hmm.

Because, later on I will, I will, um, say, I will, um, discuss the, the problem.

Mm-hmm.

But most people, most businesses, what they do is they, they would actually have

two websites and two landing pages so that they can separate the currencies.

Okay?

But for most business owners, this is an issue because it's challenging to

have two websites and two landing pages.

So what you usually do, what we small business owners do, is we only

have one website and then we have two currencies, two prices there.

Mm-hmm.

Now, again, if this is the case, you have to be sure that you

say that these are alternatives.

Mm-hmm.

There is a problem here.

The problem here is be is that most of us only use one platform, one checkout.

Mm-hmm.

And that checkout automatically converts.

Right.

One of the currencies.

Mm-hmm.

So in my, um, example a while ago, you have a digital course.

You say 200 francs or 200 euros.

Mm-hmm.

And then during checkout, your base usually is francs if you

are in Switzerland, and then the Euro only gets converted.

Right.

So what the, the pe the person sees, the consumer see when they do, when they

press the checkout button, the euro is now higher than what you actually stated.

Yeah.

So you only stated 200 France and now in the checkout it's

205 because of the conversion.

That is the problem there, right?

If you only have one platform, you want more than one currency.

Mm-hmm.

And you are just converting things.

Mm-hmm.

There is a mismatch between what you offered, what you've stated Right.

And what they're gonna pay.

Right.

Right.

So how do you solve this?

Mm-hmm.

So, at least in my business, I solve it by having two checkouts.

Mm-hmm, by Stripe.

So Stripe if you have an account there, you can have two payment links

that are separate from each other.

They are not just a conversion of each other.

Mm-hmm.

So someone can pay me euros and mm-hmm.

Because someone can pay me in Swiss francs.

Mm-hmm.

And it's not a conversion, they actually pay me what I actually offered.

Right.

So that's one thing that you need to really think about if you are going

to offer in different currencies.

Okay.

So when it comes to geo tagging mm-hmm.

I mentioned a while ago that one of the ways that you can deal with

multiple currencies is having two websites or two landing pages.

Mm-hmm.

So for a lot of businesses, they can have a Swiss website

and an international website.

Mm-hmm.

That is okay.

But as you have stated, since 2022, Switzerland prohibits geo blocking or

blocking or forcing your Swiss clients to just go to the Swiss website.

Why?

Because most of the time the Swiss website is more, more expensive.

Right?

Mm-hmm.

So this is, uh, what is being prohibited there.

Yeah.

You are not prohibited from creating two websites with different terms.

What is being prohibited is you actually restricting people from, so from choosing.

So if you have two websites, you have to let the, the, your clients choose which

website you're going to actually use.

Mm-hmm.

So in this case what, what usually happens?

How are you going to fix this?

Is you need to have different terms for your, for your two different websites.

So for example, for your international website, you can say that we do not

deliver to Swiss address if you use this website, right, that is okay.

You have different terms.

What is not okay is you automatically.

Steering blocking people and, restricting them from using that website.

Mm-hmm.

So it depends on your consumer.

Right?

If they're going to use that website, how will that thing be delivered to them?

Right.

Right.

They have to think about it.

It's not your problem to make a decision.

Yes.

But at least you gave them the choice.

Right.

Right.

Of using that website.

Okay.

So that is when we were talking about geo blocking then or geotagging,

that is the main concern that you need to really think about.

Okay.

Super.

Yes.

Okay.

A

few more here and then we're, we'll start wrapping up.

Yes.

Okay.

Marketing claims and testimonials.

Especially testimonials.

Yes.

Because I know that's a big thing that we talk about for helping

with the value perception.

Yes.

And credibility.

Mm-hmm.

Also, the marketing claims that people make.

So like I teach a lot about value and work with my clients on understanding value.

Mm-hmm.

And often they're afraid to put any sort of, um, let's say concrete value

statements on mm-hmm their website or in their marketing materials.

And so I'm curious, what do we need to watch out for in this area?

So number one is using the word guaranteed.

Mm-hmm.

I always see this.

The thing is, if you use the word guaranteed mm-hmm.

You are opening yourself to a lot of legal drama.

Why?

Because you cannot guarantee anything.

Mm-hmm.

Even if you are the best coach, even if you are the best business owner mm-hmm.

Results will always depend on your clients, their situation, their efforts.

These are the things that are beyond your control.

Mm-hmm.

And if it's beyond your control, you cannot promise it.

Right.

That's number one.

Another thing is I often see promises like you will double your earnings or you will

have more clients, or X clients at least.

Mm-hmm.

Okay?

Mm-hmm.

Having this specific words like double or ex clients, it's almost

like you are guaranteeing it.

Mm-hmm.

So I go back to my previous statement.

If it is, sounds like you are guaranteeing it mm-hmm.

Then it's going to be a problem.

Correct.

So I think the base here is that you should have alignment all over

your words, what your policies say.

Mm-hmm.

And what people think should all match.

Because if there is a mismatch there, there is misalignment.

This will always lead to legal drama.

But anyway marketing is also a whole universe.

We can talk it in a separate episode.

Yeah, yeah.

But that's something that you need to really mm-hmm.

Really think about.

If it is something that you, you know, people think as a guarantee

mm-hmm.

Remove it.

Okay.

Because you cannot guarantee anything.

Okay.

That's a great rule of thumb.

Yeah.

Yeah.

Yes.

Like that.

Okay.

Okay, so one, one more question here before we wrap this up.

Mm-hmm.

What's mm-hmm one or two simple legal hygiene checks you think every business

should be doing on their pricing page?

Yeah, so I think that question is really important because

it will help us summarize the discussion that we had so far.

So.

If we are talking about hygiene checks, I'd like you to ask

yourself just two questions.

First is, am I really being transparent?

And I've discussed transparency a while ago.

If you have consumers as clients, is the price stated on

your website the final price?

No surprises during the checkout or credit card statement.

If you are giving a discount, for example, is this a real or a fake discount?

If you are offering several currencies, you need to make sure that the amount

that you state is the amount that you actually paid, and that means that you

need to build your checkout in such a way that it respects your stated prices.

Instead of just relying solely on your platforms Fluctuating

currency conversion Now.

If the relationship is B2B, in most cases, you will have to enter into a

separate contract and what is stated on your Pricing page is just an estimate.

So transparency here requires that you have to make sure that you have

a contract that clearly state the fees to be paid, what is included,

what is not included, as well as the fees in case of extra services.

So the best way to test transparency, in my opinion it's by recruiting a

third person to read your website or your contract because it is

possible that you may have missed something or you think it is clear,

but for a third person it is not.

That is transparency.

The second thing that you need to ask yourself is if there is a question or a

dispute about Pricing do the policies on my website or my terms in, in my contract,

for example, actually back me up.

And when I say policies, I mean your terms and conditions, your refund

and cancellation rules, all of it.

You see, it's not just about simply having policies.

It is about whether they are legally aligned with the laws, where you are,

where your consumers are located, as well as whether they are aligned with

what you actually do in practice.

You see, I know that, um, a lot of you know, my audience and even you.

Heard me talk about legal alignment all the time because I really

believe that without it, you cannot set real boundaries, including

boundaries around your Pricing.

And every so often it is these very small inconsistencies between your

terms, your policies, and your processes that will turn a simple Pricing

question into a full blown drama.

So two things, transparency and legal alignment.

Okay.

What's a common misconception about pricing and the law

that you'd love to clear up?

It's, I said this a while ago.

Okay.

Most people say that if you have higher prices, you will have less clients.

This is not true.

Mm-hmm.

It's the same thing with being legally compliant.

People think that if you have all of these website policies and you have

really good contracts, people will run away because they think you're so serious

or you know, they cannot deal with you.

No pricing and legal they should be used as how you set your boundaries.

Mm-hmm.

It can sift your clients.

This is a way by which you will be able to, to have more

clients that value your work.

Mm-hmm.

Super.

I love it.

Alright.

What's next for you and your business in terms of growth?

Or do you have any special projects coming down the pipeline

you'd like to share with us?

Well, for now I'm really focusing more on building trust.

Mm-hmm.

So not really just legal legal, but more legal in business and how you can use

it in order to build a legally aligned businesses that clients will trust.

Mm-hmm.

Because I really feel that, we are now in the AI world and trust

is the currency in this world.

So I'm more focusing on how can you use trust to, for you to stand out.

Mm-hmm.

And being not drowned in a sea of lookalikes.

So that is the next thing for, for my business right now still.

You know, using legal, I'm still there.

Legal empowerment, but more using legal empowerment to build trust.

To build

trust.

Ooh, I love that.

And since you brought it up, I'm gonna sneak one more question in here.

Go ahead.

So you talked about AI and I think it was actually from you, I heard that we have

the first AI laws coming into Yes, yes.

Coming to life.

And you know, just one last tip for people.

You know, what.

What do they need to be aware of as these laws come in and do you have

any resources you can share with them?

Yes.

So in the EU we already have the EU AI Act.

Mm-hmm.

Which, was already enforced this year, and the enforcement will

continue, there will be enforcement this year and next year as well.

Mm-hmm.

And of course, because it is, uh, started by the eu, we can always

be sure that Switzerland and other countries will also follow suit.

So what they need to remember about AI is mm-hmm.

We go back to transparency.

Mm-hmm.

If you are using AI in your systems, if AI is touching your, your

client's data, for example, you need to be transparent about it.

And when we are saying touching, it's not, only when you, you know, you,

you put your, your client's data in chat, GPT, it's not just like that.

Mm-hmm.

When you, um, use softwares or applications, for example,

you use notion, you jot notes.

Mm-hmm.

Most likely than not, AI is already touching on those data.

Yeah.

And I'm not saying that you don't use AI.

You can, but you can use it responsibly.

Mm-hmm.

And you should be transparent on how you use it.

That's the bottom line here.

Now we are still, you know, all of these laws are still evolving, but at least

for small business owners, this is, uh, the, the main, the, the baseline.

You need to be transparent when you are using ai.

Mm-hmm.

And by that, it means in your, your privacy policy that yes, you

have the right things in there, is.

So you need to be, that's what you're talking about.

Yeah, exactly.

You need to be transparent.

So not only on your privacy policies mm-hmm.

In your terms, you have to mention when you are using AI

in your disclaimers as well.

Right.

So basically if you have website, you need to have a trust section

there, trust section where, and you, you really say how you are using

and protecting your client's data.

Right.

And part of it is ai.

Yes.

So, you know, the data protection and AI laws, they are converging.

Mm-hmm.

And we can see that more and more these, these two laws are, are

becoming more important and mm-hmm.

They are borrowing terms from each other.

Mm-hmm.

Mm-hmm.

That's fantastic.

Do you have a resource you'd

like

to share

with us?

Well, yes.

So if they have at least five minutes, I would invite them to go to,

www.thelegallyaffluentacademy.com/quiz.

This is a very short self audit quiz.

And by doing it.

You'll be able to know if you have gaps in your business.

Mm-hmm.

And if you are trust ready by 2026.

That is one resources they can use.

It's so fast.

Just five minutes, you'll know what is lacking in your business.

Okay.

I love it.

We'll put that link in the show notes.

Yes.

So, Vena, one last question.

Go ahead.

Before we go, where can re people reach out if they wanna find out

more about how to work with you?

So you can find me in LinkedIn, Instagram, the handle is the same

for all my social media accounts.

It's Legally She Can.

We'll be sure to put that it's in the show notes

as well.

Yes.

My website, my, my social media is the same.

Legally She Can.

Makes it simple.

Yes.

Excellent.

Well, thank you so much for coming on the show with me today.

It's been a real pleasure and I know the audience is gonna love this and

we're all learning so much from you.

Thank you very much.

Thank you so much for inviting me and having me here.

My pleasure.

Thank you for joining us for this episode of The Pricing Lady Podcast.

I wish you all the best.

Remember, be transparent, build trust, and as always, enjoy Pricing.