Pickle-Juice Fasting?? An Inside Look at Health Coaching - Session 4 Joanna

Danna Levy Hoffmann: Hi, Joanna.

What's new and good, my dear?

how are you?

Danna Levy Hoffmann: I'm well.

How are you?

also, well, yeah.

Feeling good these days.

Danna Levy Hoffmann: Good.

Tell me a bit about that.

That's always good to hear.

I don't know, just been feeling like I have a lot of

energy, which is really nice.

So nice change from before.

Danna Levy Hoffmann: Nice.

What do you think attributed to that?

I think, I don't know, maybe like the fewer carbs I think is really

helping, especially in the afternoons.

so that afternoon slump if I have it, then it's maybe like 15 minutes around

four instead of kind of starting at two and then dragging on for the afternoon.

But yeah, I really noticed a difference.

So thank you for that.

Danna Levy Hoffmann: That's amazing.

I mean, I didn't do anything.

You did all the work.

I was just there to, you know, support a little bit.

But you should.

You should thank yourself.

Okay.

Danna Levy Hoffmann: Excellent.

Anything else?

New and good?

I mean, that was a great start, but.

no, not really.

Let's say the biggest news from my side.

Danna Levy Hoffmann: Excellent.

Excellent.

that is really good news.

I'm always happy to hear positive changes, especially when it has

to do with stuff that we talked about and communicated about.

So that's really happy I got your images and food diary.

Food log that I kind of reviewed shortly this morning.

And, but you didn't mention on the chat that this week was kind of touch and go

and didn't work as well, but that you're kind of ready to, to jump right back on.

exactly.

Yeah.

Danna Levy Hoffmann: And I was wondering what do you think would be more beneficial

to you, do you think looking into what happened that kind of helped you?

To come off of the course or more, like, look through the stuff

that you sent me and give you a little bit of, of feedback there.

or a completely different topic maybe, I don't know, maybe something else

that you had in mind and on your heart.

oof.

Good question.

not sure.

I guess we could start with maybe some ways to, stay on top of the

food logging, that's difficult.

I

Danna Levy Hoffmann: Mm-hmm.

have a really stupid reason that it was difficult, which is

that the notebook I was keeping the food login was in my purse, and then

sometimes it was just on the other side of the house and I forgot about it.

And then once I'd forgotten about it,

Danna Levy Hoffmann: Sure.

like, whoa,

Danna Levy Hoffmann: So, so

what I ate yesterday in the afternoon.

And you know, I didn't wanna just write down sort of

Danna Levy Hoffmann: yeah.

Well.

But let me ask you a question.

So it wasn't the actual eating habits, it was just the logging that you kind of.

That kind of fell through.

Oh, okay.

No, then, then, then, then I'm super happy because I don't know if you feel like the

logging actually helps you also keep up with everything, or if you feel like, no,

I'm, I got this, you know, it maybe it's helpful to jump into it once in a while,

but I don't feel like that's a huge miss.

On your end.

I don't think you should feel bad about that because in life, I mean, who, who

does food logging all day every day?

You know, it's, it's just, for me, it was very helpful to get an

overview of how your weeks look.

And the question is if, for you, it is in any way helpful.

Or do you feel that you wanna continue it?

Because it's just becoming a habit.

But I don't think you should be too worried about missing

days, is all I'm saying.

think that aspect that we talked about last time, that sort

of because you know, you have to log it, it sort of changes your

behavior is a little helpful for me.

Danna Levy Hoffmann: Yeah.

It could kind of keep me in line like, okay, if I have like a piece of

chocolate cake, then I know I'm gonna have to write it down on my food log.

Danna Levy Hoffmann: Which you did, which I'm proud.

Which I have still a quarter of my birthday cake in the freezer

that just calls to me in the evening.

So struggling a bit with that.

Danna Levy Hoffmann: Fair enough.

kind of played into why I didn't log.

some days I was like,

Danna Levy Hoffmann: Ever since my birthday, I haven't.

I wonder why.

to fess up.

But yeah.

I don't know, maybe.

I think let's have a goal maybe so that we keep it for another two weeks until

our next session and see that goes.

If I feel like it's still bringing something some value.

Danna Levy Hoffmann: sure.

Sounds good.

So how about this, you know, I, I was kind of thinking of a few ideas of how to.

Make sure that you continue with the food logging as best as you

can for the next couple of weeks.

And one thing you did mention in the past was, I don't wanna use my phone, which

I can respect, especially around food.

I'll rule at home is like you're on the, you're eating your,

do not have your phone on you.

So I can definitely respect that.

You did mention also that probably part of the problem was that the notebook was

just elsewhere and out of sight, out of mind, or laziness or whatever it may be.

That, or, or that chocolate cake doesn't matter.

No judgment.

But something kind of kept you away from from logging so.

Why don't we try something else and let me know if this triggers another idea for you

or seems reasonable let's brainstorm here.

I was thinking maybe of having like just sticky notes in another side of the house.

So around the kitchen or around where you usually sit down to eat,

where you can just jot things down.

And because it's a sticky note, you can just stick it instead.

You don't have to transfer it, you can just stick it and write the date on top.

And that's kind of a keeper in the notebook.

Again, just to brainstorm, so maybe you have another idea

no, I think that's a good idea.

Like just some in various

Danna Levy Hoffmann: I.

where I tend to pause and have a minute to reflect on things.

I can

Danna Levy Hoffmann: Hmm.

My kids love office supplies, so I'm not sure how long that

will last, but I'll give it a go.

Danna Levy Hoffmann: Makes sense.

Makes sense.

Okay, excellent.

So I'm just trying to think of maybe another little motivation or another

little, idea that will help trigger that.

But I don't know if you have any other kind of ideas where you feel like a

certain area or certain time of day or a certain space is a bit harder to log.

Is it more in the office or more?

I don't know.

for me at the office.

So it's on

Danna Levy Hoffmann: Okay.

hard when I'm home and I don't

Danna Levy Hoffmann: Okay.

a. Quiet, you know, at the office I can kind of take a minute.

I can like remember what I had for dinner last night, note what I'm having for lunch

and then I've got sort of 24 hours there.

Danna Levy Hoffmann: Yeah.

it.

Everything like fell off the rails on the weekend and we had a

Danna Levy Hoffmann: Okay.

Okay.

so it was just yeah, that just all went off.

Danna Levy Hoffmann: Okay, no problem.

So let's think about another thing.

you're really trying hard to really maintain quite a healthy food intake.

We can definitely discuss about things here and there but it really shows

that you're really doing your best.

So what if.

It's usually easier to remember the, the stuff that I wasn't too happy

about that I ate, you know what I mean?

Like the salad is like forgotten, but like, ooh, but that cake, that

cake was looking at me, you know?

So either just note that down or again, another thing that we can kind

of evolve into doing is more marking very simple red, green, orange.

On a day, right?

So when you reflect back on the day in the evening and you go like, you

know what, breakfast was amazing.

Snacks were amazing.

Yeah.

between lunch and dinner I did, have blank, which I'm not too happy about.

I'd categorize it as a red, I'd categorize it as an orange, you know?

then at least you have that overview because I think what's more important.

Then looking at how one day is structured.

It's also important to see how frequently we're actually having the things that

we think we're having infrequently,

Hmm.

Danna Levy Hoffmann: right?

So we're, we're kind of thinking like, oh, I'll have this once a

week, but then it's like, oh crap, it's like 3, 4, 5 times a week.

And I don't notice because.

So it might be a good way to evolve into just thinking like, how is my day overall?

Super proud of myself.

I can't think of one thing.

It's a fricking green, you know, or, uh, I had this, Danna said that maybe

this is not necessarily unhealthy, but maybe it's, you know, more triggering

the glucose levels in the body.

and then it's a little bit easier also for you to see the, the overview

because when we look at the pictures one by one Yeah, it's, it's great and

it's helpful and I don't know if you.

Just to, just to update our, our listeners quickly.

So what you did was you sent me a lot of stuff that was like videos.

I mean, it was amazing.

You're so organized.

It's ridiculous.

I mean, if Megan looked at it, she probably was very proud

because she, she's the only person I know who's got organized.

but I was overwhelmed with it.

I was like, yikes.

Okay, so you reorganized it and send it to me again and I don't know how.

Much detail.

You kind of reviewed the stuff again, if you get had a chance to kind of look at

it and what your thoughts were maybe you had some aha moments there or maybe just

felt super proud, all or good feelings.

Just wondering what you

Yeah,

Danna Levy Hoffmann: mind.

of had a hard time looking at it, so I didn't wanna go through.

I felt some resistance to

Danna Levy Hoffmann: Okay.

every single photo on every single day.

So kind of did just like a high level.

Reorganization for you and left it at that and I thought, okay, I will, I would

like to maybe hear your insights from what you saw, but I dunno, it was almost

like, you know, looking at pictures of yourself after an event or something.

Like, I don't, I don't know if I wanna see this.

Danna Levy Hoffmann: Okay, no, no problem.

and the last question that I have, and then I'm happy to give you some,

some feedback on certain things.

The last question that I have is, so you did this with the CGM.

can you on your own, you don't have to share it with me if you don't want

to, but would you be able to see kind of like, oh, on this day, at this

time, you still have that information?

I don't think.

I could maybe get it, actually, wait.

Wait.

I. Maybe is the, the question, I still have the data on my phone,

but I need to look into how to extract it and then map it to the

days, and the photos of what I ate.

Yeah.

'cause that would be, that's exactly what I wanted to have.

And I was, yeah.

I think the data was living in two separate apps and, God, it would

be so cool if there was just like.

kind of, app where you just did your food logging with the photo and it

mapped it to your CGM data, and then you could really see like, right, yes.

Danna Levy Hoffmann: So there, there is, Megan and I actually tested

out a product called ve, VERI and and there you can actually do that.

So you can take a photo.

Just really simple.

You can log in if you want to add extra notes, but you can

just take a photo and that's it.

And then you really see like two hours later that

information is very, very clear.

so if and when you decide to do another CGM, that's, that's an

idea as to really, again, it's been years that we tested it out.

I need to research a little bit and see if they're still working and in

the same capacity and everything.

But there are probably more.

Yeah.

Danna Levy Hoffmann: More of those by now.

I mean, but, what we can look at today, just shortly, because we don't have all

the time in the world, but I think it would be a little bit helpful for you,

because I assume that also when you notice this in real time, you're like, oh, okay.

my glucose levels are are high.

That's the breakfast I had.

'cause you did mention that there were certain moments when

you were like, oh, interesting.

so I don't wanna kind of go over it too, too much ad nauseam where you actually had

these aha moments momentarily at least.

but I do see, for example, the breakfast, which is considered a

healthier kind of, Breakfast to have, which is the granola with the fruits

and, and the yogurt And I see some nuts and seeds in there, which is great.

The real question is how your body is reacting to such a breakfast,

because it still is high on.

fructose, I mean, at the end of the day, right, because I'm seeing

blueberries and I'm seeing, nectarine which are, higher in fructose.

So, I mean, blueberries are not necessarily, but long story short,

that is something that you need to really see for yourself because if

you had that handful of nuts maybe before and then had that breakfast,

it might not, you might not react as.

You did if you had it all in one bowl.

And this is also assuming that the yogurt is, kind of flavorless so, so unsweetened.

That it's dairy or are you having, 'cause I know you have oat milk, so

again, the dairy still by default has a lot of sugar, unfortunately.

natural sugars.

So we need to kind of think about that and see, okay, interesting.

How is my body reacting to that?

And one of the best ways to also notice that is how is your hunger.

For the next meal, do you feel like there's a sugar crash, so you're

maybe a little shaky or maybe all of a sudden the hunger comes very rapidly

and kind of surprises you and you're like hangry now, and things like that?

Or is it like, oh, when I eat this breakfast I can stretch a bit longer?

You know what I mean?

So those are all, yeah.

have that breakfast and I usually won't get hungry

until, you know, 10 30 or 11.

And if I have that around then, then.

I don't wanna eat until three or four kind of throws off my whole day.

'cause then I'm like, I don't want lunch.

but then I,

Danna Levy Hoffmann: Yeah.

a small lunch thing kind of right before dinner time.

But, but it

Danna Levy Hoffmann: Right, right.

Okay.

Well,

for a good four or five hours.

And then, no, I don't feel like super, like hunger pangs.

I think for me

Danna Levy Hoffmann: okay.

Perfect.

breakfast.

I have it.

Yeah, but I mean the, yeah, I don't know what it does to my blood sugar.

I don't ever feel sleepy after that.

Danna Levy Hoffmann: Yeah, I mean, it wouldn't necessarily be, you

know, again, each person reacts differently, so it could, it doesn't

have to be the, the sleepiness or, or like the, you know, yeah.

Some people feel sleepy or feel like they're really low on energy

now and they need to pick me up.

They'll go for the coffee or the chocolate or the carbs or whatever.

one thing that you can definitely do is just add chia seeds to the equation.

Let the chia seeds sit in the yogurt a little bit, just to

soak up a bit of the liquid.

Five, 10 minutes is enough and then add everything else in there so you're

adding even more fiber and chia seeds help you feel satiated for even longer.

And just picking up on what you said, which is basically that you usually

get hungrier around 10 11, I would.

Again, and this is just planting a seed in your head for next time, we can definitely

start discussing again, intermittent fasting, because I think that If you

naturally stretch that long, getting another couple of hours, making sure

that you have the 16 hour mark, which is where the sweet spot is, and then going

into a lunch or even a meal like this.

Honestly, if you feel like you need your breakfast as a B, you know what I mean?

You need the first meal that you eat.

To be a breakfast then that's fine as well.

But Then we can definitely do some intermittent fasting.

where it, could definitely help with some weight loss if that's still a goal.

it can help with a lot of other things honestly, because the beautiful thing

about intermittent fasting is that we bring ourselves to a point where

our body the new and healthy cells are eating up the old cells, so.

You're eating yourself sounds really creepy, but, but your body is literally

eating itself, like eating the dead cells, so it keeps you younger, right?

Okay.

Danna Levy Hoffmann: ketosis is a, is a next level.

Ketosis is where we have very, very few carbs.

There's no such thing as no carbs, so whoever tells you no carb

is talking out of their butt.

But when you have very, very little to, to hardly any carbs, and then

your body, what your body does in ketosis is our body right now gets its

energy from carbs and sugar, right.

How it works.

And when we go into ketosis, the body starts getting the energy from fat.

So it's actually burning our own fat in order to get energy, which

is just a beautiful state as well.

it's doable.

It's a little bit harder with a, with a more vegetarian diet.

because as we said, a lot of the proteins that you would consume as a

vegetarian, are actually carbs as well.

So it's a little bit harder to maintain that low carb intake.

but it's not.

Doable.

It's just the next step, and I wouldn't want to jump right into that first.

It's gonna be, you know,

those are,

Danna Levy Hoffmann: I think the intermittent fasting can be.

fasts, right after like 18, 20 hours.

Danna Levy Hoffmann: You don't have to fast with keto.

No, no.

You don't have to fast.

It's two different worlds you can focus on a ketogenic diet without

doing intermittent fasting, and you can do intermittent fasting

and it has nothing to do with keto.

Um.

It's just two different ways to, to help our body.

I think you did correct me if I'm wrong, and I'm sorry this is, I

might be wrong, but did you mention at some point in the chat that you

noticed some signs of pre-diabetes?

Was that correct or was that

well, my, my glucose monitor said my fasting glucose

was in the pre-diabetic range.

but I. A blood test at the doctor to check my hba one C

and it is on the very low range.

So, although I heard, and I am by far not the expert in this, I heard that it is

possible to have like a short term, higher sort of fasting glucose level, that your

long-term levels can still be quite low.

So I'm not sure about that.

But um, yeah, I think that the diagnostic criteria is definitely that hba one c. so

Danna Levy Hoffmann: Okay.

Okay, so, so we won't get into that then.

Megan is our diabetes pre-diabetes expert, so she might jump in, on the

chat and maybe give you some ideas.

We also recorded a couple of episodes about pre-diabetes, or at least one So

you might wanna, just have a listen.

I think it's a Relatively short episode.

But I do think that if you're open to it, we can definitely discuss

intermittent fasting and see how we can stretch you for those extra, for

that extra one, one and a half hours.

Towards noon.

again, kind of assuming that maybe you're done eating at seven.

So of course it depends on the night before when you had dinner,

Yeah.

Danna Levy Hoffmann: cetera.

six 30 or seven at the latest.

Danna Levy Hoffmann: Okay, perfect.

So what I would say is just one thing that is very important for me to say.

Intermittent fasting should not and does not have to happen every day.

Okay.

it's really important to keep your body on its toes.

Sounds funny, but you know, it's super important.

because when we get into a certain rhythm, the, the metabolism is like laid back.

It's like, I know what's happening, it's fine, but when we keep it on its toes.

switching exercise from morning to afternoon, intermittent

fasting here and there.

Doing these kind of things is actually more helpful to the body than we think.

People think like we need to be a hundred percent perfect all the time.

That's not necessarily the case.

So what I would recommend doing is either deciding for yourself if you have

specific days that you know it's going to be easier to intermittent fast, either

when you're home ing or when you're at the office, for example, or you know,

during the week, but not on the weekend.

So these are kind of thoughts that you can put into.

When do I intermittent fast.

And the second thought is around your dinner.

don't hate Me, I'm gonna pick the worst dinner that you had on your

log, which was like a pizza, right?

A couple slices of pizza.

When you have pizza in the evening.

Do not, I know it's the easiest just to go like, I was so bad.

I'm gonna intermittent fast tomorrow to erase what I did.

That's probably the worst thing that you can do just because it's going to,

you're just gonna suffer through it.

You're gonna be super hungry, you're not gonna be happy.

You know, your glucose is gonna be all over the place, so it's

not as helpful as knowing.

I had a, here I'm picking on another really good one.

Kale salad with meatballs and tomato sauce.

Perfect dinner, right?

I don't know if there were Carbs in there.

Maybe there were slow carbs in there.

that is a perfect dinner to then say, great.

tomorrow I'm gonna do intermittent fasting.

'cause it'll be easier for me.

So we're coming from love and not from like, I need to kick myself

and do this because I'm terrible, but rather like, I'm so good.

I'm gonna continue riding on that wave.

Okay, so the first thing is to look at your dinner.

and the timing also.

Reflect on the next day and say, okay, great.

I'm working from home.

It'll be very easy for me to then intermittent fast.

I will focus on X, Y, and Z during my fast.

We'll discuss that a little bit, and then I can also focus on how I break the fast.

Okay, so for me, those are the three most important things in intermittent fasting.

what is my dinner?

What am I consuming during the fast and how am I breaking the fast?

Because all three of those things can come in very handy to you

or can shoot you in the leg.

we talked about dinner.

It should be a more kind of, full of fiber, rich in healthy

fats and protein focused dinner.

you can also try.

After having, for example, that same exact dinner, kale salad, tomato sauce,

and meatballs and brown rice, and you should notice for yourself, and this

is where the logging comes in handy.

Notice for yourself, was that easier for me than that day where I had

the exact meal without the rice?

It's just a real question for you to see if it, it was more supportive.

is dinner kind of clear or do you have any questions about dinner?

it's.

Danna Levy Hoffmann: Okay, perfect.

The things that you can consume during a fast, we're talking about drinks black

coffee, no oat milk and stuff like that.

tea, black tea, green tea.

Not fruit tea, not like fruit-based tea.

'cause you still get that residual sugar, And the best thing that I find

to extend the fasting when you feel like, I'm gonna start getting peckish

at this hour, or you kind of feel it coming, is apple cider vinegar drink.

I have it in the menu plan so you can check it out.

It's basically, apple cider vinegar that is not filtered or pasteurized.

I can show you one afterwards or I'll send you a picture.

and apple cider vinegar with water and salt.

That sounds good.

Sounds like pickle juice.

Danna Levy Hoffmann: It is so good.

I'm so happy that you say that because you usually, people look at

me, they're like, you're disgusting.

It is.

It's pickle juice.

It's like sauerkraut juice.

I, I'm one of the only maniacs who buys the sauerkraut juice in the store.

I'm like, oh my God, this is great.

That's what it tastes like.

Really delicious.

If it doesn't taste delicious, I challenge you to add more vinegar and more salt.

' cause usually it's just not enough and it's like dirty water.

It should really be this really savory drink.

Yeah, that

Danna Levy Hoffmann: Okay?

And you can have a whole like half a liter of it.

Now, this specific drink is super helpful before eating anything honestly.

Really, really helpful.

but it's generally quite helpful during the fast and especially as you said,

I'm hungry usually around 10 30, 11.

make like a half a liter of it and start sipping on it at 10.

Don't chug it like it's a medicine.

Just kind of like enjoy it.

And that actually extends the hunger or not extends the hunger.

Extends the, yeah, the make sure you're not as hungry.

And it also puts your body in a fasting state faster, which means

that even if you don't hit the 16 hour mark, your body is probably

still, going into that state faster.

so there's no worry about that.

So that's just a drink that you can definitely enjoy.

Also, try it.

just today, maybe in the afternoon, just have a citrus.

Make sure you know how much, it's like half a teaspoon of salt, like if not more,

depending on the salt that you're using.

So don't be scared about the salt either, because the hunger sometimes

is just minerals that our body needs.

the last thing that you can also consume if we find a good

brand for you is electrolytes.

And are super helpful and Yeah.

So as long as there's no sugar in it or there's no sugar replacement, that

kind of fools your body into thinking that you actually need more food now.

So mainly Stevia and Monk Fruit should be the ones, or maybe Allulose, right?

So those three.

Okay, sweeteners.

Megan can send you an electrolyte recipe.

I can also give you my favorite one, which is on i Herb I'm obsessed, Sure.

and then the one most important thing afterwards is how you break your fast.

If you break your fast with a high carb meal, then you might as well not have.

Fasted.

Because what happens now is that when you're in a fasting state and

you start eating, your cells are open and they'll take everything in.

They're, they're starving, they want food.

And so if you put carbs in, it just goes in and turns into fat in our body.

But when you're, consuming you know, start with an egg or two.

Start with a chicken breast.

Start with some protein intake.

Even if you just start with that and half an hour later you have

a more carby lunch, it's okay.

It's better than starting immediately with that carby lunch.

So I would say just start with a really good meal.

Try to avoid raw vegetables That will be really hard to digest.

What do you think about that?

Does that sound like something that is reasonable, that you wanna try?

Maybe a couple times?

absolutely.

I think, the intermittent fasting does fit well.

although the whole like, change up the times is a little difficult for me

because I'm really a person of habit.

So, I

Danna Levy Hoffmann: Yeah.

don't like to, I don't know, and I don't know if you meant

this for the intermittent fasting, like occasionally skip dinner

or so, and then have breakfast.

I do not like to do that.

Danna Levy Hoffmann: No, no,

but

Danna Levy Hoffmann: no, no, no, no, no.

What I, what I meant was not,

Yeah.

Danna Levy Hoffmann: it's just not to intermittent fast every

single day, because that's just not, it's not as helpful either, so

yeah.

But that fits really well, into my schedule and, I will try

the apple cider vinegar drink.

That sounds really good.

Danna Levy Hoffmann: keep me updated.

It is really good and I, I love it when people actually enjoy it.

I always feel bad when people are like, that was disgusting.

What are you doing to me?

excellent.

So give it a try.

Keep us updated on the WhatsApp group just in case.

you have questions or in case you need a little bit of extra

support, we're always here.

and the menu plan that I sent you can also help you to kind of see, okay, great.

these are good ideas or, or whatever.

but that can be helpful as well.

Perfect.

Okay.

Danna Levy Hoffmann: Cool.

much.

Danna Levy Hoffmann: Excellent.

Yeah, no problem.

So just to mention again the goals that we discussed.

We were talking about putting sticky notes to kind of continue

with the food logging because you do feel that it's helpful to you,

Or the stoplight

Danna Levy Hoffmann: and to.

Yes, exactly.

Or do that, whatever feels right to you in that moment, that's fine.

You can mix and match as well.

And then just trying out the intermittent fasting maybe a couple times a week.

See how that works for you.

just try to count from the, from around the time that

you finished eating 16 hours.

and if it feels like it's overwhelming, 14 hours is fine, and

then moving up to 15 hours is fine.

Just find your rhythm and find the things that support you.

Some people find certain drinks are really supportive, so give that a

try and, and let us know how it goes.

good.

Will do.

Danna Levy Hoffmann: Awesome.

talk

Danna Levy Hoffmann: All right,

time.